Talk:Boros/@comment-116.240.233.124-20170714041733/@comment-33195013-20171029113554

1. what are you talking about, this is a very consistent feat, we've heard that beerus can do this, if two gods of destruction fight it will, and zeno can destroy time lines, goku destroyed a small pocket dimension, etc, it's not a hyperbole, plus, this was an attack that would destroy it, other statements like it were just that they could destroy the universe, no time frame, no specific attack. This is the biggest thing, why would they want to? it's why they don't destroy planets, they don't want to just kill everything, goku only this by accident because his SSG body had so much power that he didn't have full control. note one of the words you said there, intends to destroy the universe, that doesn't mean he'll do it straight away, and even goku saying he’ll make the universe go poof is very vague. They say buu would wipe out all life in the universe is not destroying the universe.

EDIT: Goku and Jiren shook the entire Void, a universe with no time or space, and Jiren overpowered time, both would make them universe level+.

2. these aren't your points, i will add them any way. they were going to destroy the macroverse, our universe, heaven and hell, plus the kai realm, which is 1 tenth the size of the other universes combined, 3.3 universes, also, the db universe isn't condensed, look at the comparison between snake way, and king kai's planet, also, we've seen galaxies, which contradicts that a universe is only as large as snake way.

3. your next point is really stupid, firstly, if it was going to destroy the universe with matter manipulation, why were there fractured planets, and why was there a large explosion after, that argument is literally contradicted by why you think they are multi planet level, and goku only has a basic form of matter manipulation, btw, telekinesis, and the ability to convert ki into light, he's never shown anything else. Also, you are very wrong about that point where their godly ki reacts, if you actually watch the fight, it’s the force field Bulma sets up, and the clouds going dark, nothing to do with godly ki, the wether changed when goku went ss 3 once https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RUxKlWcb-Ro. That wave in their first proves nothing, Goku and beerus never did that before, so it literally doesn’t contradict anything, especially since that’s their pure energy, which is part of their power, it’s called an aura, it might look different, but watch the fight between first form frieza and vegeta, you’ll know what I mean.

4. you are focusing on the wrong feat, you forget that beerus absorbed the energy that was going to destroy the macroverse, and goku stopped an attack capable of destroying the macroverse.

5. if we went by that logic, his destructive capacity would be low multiversal, because he was going to destroy 3 universes and one that is a tenth these universes, but, it's universe level regardless due to happening in one attack, which is actually attack potency.

6. in your google plus page you said that the shockwaves are multi planet level, i think this is true, but it wasn't the shockwaves that were going to destroy the universe, it was the point of impact, if you actually watch the episode you see a large explosion after the final clash, which they said was going to destroy the universe, not shockwaves tearing apart the universe, also i do know that this was energy attacks instead of the punches, but that's irrelevant, it still proves that these were a by product.

7. this doesn't contradict the narrator or whis, as it's the shockwaves that will do this part of the damage, not the point of impact, the point of impact would destroy the universe after the clashes.

8. the rest already debunk your claims about the macroverse not being destroyed, as we literally see an explosion that doesn't happen in the first 2 clashes.

9. again, not one of you points, but still. these clearly aren't normal shockwaves, these are ki shockwaves, they actually show us the difference in super, jiren punches causing a shockwave, it looks and acts like a normal shockwaves, but vegeta causes a shockwave, it's yellow, and doesn't have a water cone, also, in a recent episode, caulifa and goku punch each other, creating a giant yellow explosion, they didn't use a ki blast anytime during the exchange, also, if these were normal shockwaves, how did they travel through space, pressure waves need matter to travel.

10. you tend to conveniently forget that beerus was heavily suppressed, and that whis wasn’t interfering, especially since beerus later absorbs it, seriously, did you not see how much of a hole that is in your argument, also, the absorption isn’t hax, as beerus powered up to do it (that last part wasn't one of your points, it's just to disprove a future point you might have)

11. The arguements about the transcriber, narrarator, etc are basically useless, and have no bearing for either party, what you should focus on is beerus and everyone else saying it, everyone in the story says it and using the excuse that it's just for drama is extremely bias and ignoring information.

Nice job skipping out on context.

No, we do not know from your biased arguments that Beerus and Goku aren't universe level, especially since the show has contradicted this multiple times.

God of destruction matter manipulation Imgur

Goku and Beerus' energy respectthreads, whowouldwin GIF | Create, Discover and Share on Gfycat

At 2:53 you can see that punches can cause energy explosions Goku Vs Copy Vegeta Full Fight - Eng Sub - YouTube